What do you do when you lose your husband to suicide? How do you live with it every single day, and how do you talk about it with other people? I sit down with Erin Carlson, who shares how she became a widow at 36 and was left with three children after her husband committed suicide. Now in her eighth year of widowhood just like me, she explains how she breaks the stigma around suicide and why conversations around it must never be shunned. Erin also emphasizes why those in law enforcement need proper mental health support, remembering the legacy of her husband who was once part of the police force.
I am sharing my experience of loving the same man for 32 years, a mother to two adult children, a retired military officer, a breast cancer survivor, and my connections with others.
Anyone experiencing suicidal thoughts should reach out to a suicide hotline or local emergency number in their country: Psychology Today Suicide Hotlines and Prevention Resources Around the World.
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Watch the episode here
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Dealing With Her Husband’s Suicide With Erin Carlson
What do you do when you’re widowed at 36 with three children? What do you do when suicide is awkward to talk about, but that’s your situation? My conversation with Erin is going to give you answers to that question and more. Let’s get into the discussion. Erin is here to share and help you know that you are not alone, and that the way you became a widow matters.
Hello, Erin. Welcome to the widowhood.
Thank you, Tina.
Really, thank you? What goes through your mind when you hear, “Welcome to the widowhood?” Yes, thank you. That’s what I want to hear. What is the ticker tape in your mind when you hear something like that?
I heard you ask this question before. I definitely thought of my response. I think someone else said it. It’s like the club that you don’t want to be a part of, but for whatever reason, you end up part of it.
Widowhood is like being part of a club you do not want to be in, but for whatever reason, you end up joining. Share on XDo you feel like you can ever be honest about not wanting to be part of that club?
Yes.
In what spaces?
Someone who has gone through it before, like you, like here, and people that I let in and that know me.
That brings an interesting question because sometimes, the people who knew us with our spouse may not be the people who get let in. What does that look like, the people who let you in versus the ones who don’t?
There’s a certain level of my story that I tell people, and then there’s a certain deeper level that I tell other people, like my friends who have gone through it and fellow widows. Even if they haven’t friends that I’ve made friends in recent years, there’s so much to being a widow and what I went through. I know we haven’t even gotten there yet, but since it was a suicide death, it changes things. Some people don’t want to hear it, or they can’t handle it, so I have to be careful.
Thank you. Your husband’s name, Erin?
Drew.
Thank you for sharing that. Thank you for trusting me that this is a safe space. Obviously, you’ve listened to some other conversations. You know my intentions for why we do this. Do you feel like it’s helpful to be in a place where you can share your story and not have to hold back?
Yes. It’s helpful for me to have that opportunity in that space. It’s helpful for others because one of the stories that I listened to was about someone very similar to me. When we had talked about this opportunity for me to do this here, I went back and forth. Once I heard that story, I thought I should do this so that the next person coming along, if they happen to experience it, they know they’re not alone. It is because there are so many feelings that come up with it.
It is. You’re absolutely right. Oftentimes, we want to know we’re not alone, but it seems difficult to connect. It seems difficult to be transparent and make your situation available. You’re right. I also say this, no matter how your spouse passed, people want to go, “How did they die?” It’s like, “How are you doing?” You’re asking me that question. I have a topical response. “Somebody passed,” versus the somebody who wants the details, and I want to share my story. I hear that’s what you were saying. Is that similar? Am I understanding?
You’re right.
How Erin Met Her Husband
How did you meet Drew?
He was a police officer. When he passed, he was a Sergeant in Danbury. All he ever wanted to do was become a Sergeant in Danbury. In order to get there, he had to start in a very small town. That was in New Fairfield. That’s where I’m from. I started working as a dispatcher there. I was involved in the fire department. I was an EMT. I started as a dispatcher, and I loved it. He was one of the officers there, and I met him.
Did you hear his voice and go, “Okay, Daddy,” or did you see him? How was the connection? Were you listening and going, “Okay, Officer.”
Honestly, I loved his voice, but it was when he came in and introduced himself. They would introduce themselves to the new dispatcher. His hands were so soft. He said he had never worked a day in his life. That was his comeback, too, which was so funny because it’s so not true. He always worked. His eyes were blue. He had his hat on. He was so handsome. He called me ma’am. He was very respectful, always.
You meet him there. How does it shift to, “Are we going out?” Does he ask you as a group? How does this first date or interaction happen?
I asked him out. I got his phone number from one of our fellow dispatchers. I had been working there for a month. I called him, and I left a message. He was on the night shift, so I figured I’d hear from him. He called me back. We talked for five or six hours.
It was the first phone call.
Yes. I said, “I wanted to know if you wanted to go out.” He said, “How is tomorrow?”
He was as quick as you were.
He was. He picked me up outside my college dorm. I was 21. I thought, “I’m not going to recognize him without his uniform. He’s going to be in regular clothes.” He told me he had a white car. He pulled up. He picked me up. We went to Applebee’s. We saw My Big Fat Greek Wedding because he was a gentleman and let me choose.
He went for the chick flick. Did he act like he was engaged? Was he on his phone, or was he like, “I’m here?”
No, he loved it. I think so. We definitely use some of those lines as inside jokes between us.
Was there a kiss on this first day?
Yes. It was so long ago. When he brought me back to my dorm, it was a very quick kiss. We were inseparable. We saw a movie again a couple of days later.
What year is this? You said forever. How long ago? What year is this?
It was November 2002.
That is quite a bit of time. You become inseparable. How does the relationship mature? How does it go meeting family? Give us some of that.
We moved everything along fast. We started dating in November 2002. We moved in together in January. I was leaving school. I wasn’t sure what I wanted to do. I was not doing well in school. I said, “I’m done.” We ended up moving in together. I moved out of the dorm. He moved out of where he was living with his brother. We got an apartment together. Meeting the family, they were enchanted. They were enthralled with him.
Were you nervous? Was this the first time meeting somebody else’s family? How did that go for you?
I don’t think I was nervous. I don’t know if he was, but they loved him. We haven’t done it in a few years since COVID, but we always did a caroling party with Christmas carols around my neighborhood. He came to that first one. I think it was the only one he ever came to because my grandmother said, “Everyone, I want you to meet New Fairfield’s finest.” He was mortified. He was so bright red, but he loved her, and she loved him. He was a gentleman. He felt nervous. In February, we got engaged.
How was the engagement? How did that happen?
We went to Rhode Island. It was winter time. We went to the beach. We went to some of his favorite places from growing up because they always went to Rhode Island on vacations. We were at a hotel. It’s called the Sand Dollar Inn. It was very sweet, quick, and romantic. He got on his knee and gave me a ring. That was it.
Were you expecting it? Were you totally surprised? Did your family know ahead of time?
He might’ve asked my dad. I’m sure he did actually. That was the kind of person he was. They were surprised. We had my aunt’s birthday party in upstate New York. We went up, and we told everyone there. My aunt announced it for us. A lot of the family was meeting him for the first time.
In November, the first date. In January, move in. In February, engage. Where do we go from there?
We went on a road trip to Florida. We drove to Florida right after the party. We spent a few days there together in Disney. We adopted a dog because why not?
It’s a baby starter family thing.
We drove back up to Connecticut. I got pregnant in June. We were planning the wedding in November, but I got pregnant in June. We had a quick civil ceremony on July 29th, so a couple of days ago, and then we had our wedding.
It was less than a year, or just about.
Everything was in a year. Our daughter was born in February.
How was it being a mom? How was he as a dad?
He was very sweet. I was 22. I felt like I knew nothing. My daughter is an adult now and says, “I don’t know how you had a baby at this age.” I said, “I don’t know either. I didn’t know anything. I thought I did.” He was sweet and hands-on. We have three kids.
Going Through Wedding Anniversaries After A Loss
They are keeping you busy. He was a hands-on dad in doing all of that. You mentioned your wedding anniversary. I have a sense of what that’s like for me. Can you explain what it was like for you in every year leading up to your wedding anniversary, Drew not being here?
It’s hard. I like to say that the brain forgets, but the heart remembers, because leading up to everything, I’ll forget about it. It’ll be just a day, but then I’ll feel something. I don’t feel right. I don’t feel well. I’m emotional. I’m tired. It clicks. “That’s right. It’s something coming up.” It’s not just an anniversary. We had two wedding anniversaries, but it’s the kids’ birthdays. It’s a big deal. He passed on September 3rd, and my son’s birthday is August 22nd. It’s close. I give myself a lot of grace. I give myself a lot of time. I know that I’m not going to be up to par on everything. It’s grief. It sneaks up a lot.
The Deep Impact Of Grief In Daily Life
You said Drew left this world on September 3rd. What year, Erin?
It was 2017.
We are both in the same year track of this scenario. If you bumped into someone in the grocery store and you start talking, and they say something about your husband. Sometimes, we talk about them like it is a current thing. It’s been eight years since they passed, and you’re still having a hard time. They would respond, “Why are you still having a hard time? It’s been eight years.” What would be your honest answer you would want to give them versus the polite thing we often say?
Immediately, what came up was, “You’re lucky not to have gone through that because you don’t know what it’s like.” Maybe I would have thought something. I don’t know if I would say it ever, but maybe I would have thought that if someone had told me that before I went through it myself. “You’re still struggling?” I would say, “You’re lucky not to have experienced a loss, especially after so much love that it’s not still with you.”
Thank you. Do you think people, and maybe even yourself, before, do not realize the depth to which grief impacts our lives?
Yes.
What have been some things you’ve learned that you were like, “I did not expect that.”? When I think of that for me, in my mind, “The funeral is over. I know he’s not here. I got a lot of stuff that I need to do,” but that was like, “No, every breath of air is impacted by him no longer being here forever.”
I feel that. Something that always catches me off guard is when it’s a hot summer day. It’s our days in a row towards the end of the summer, so August, and then all of a sudden, it’s a cool day. I’m back in that moment. It’s so painful. It still surprises me because I don’t expect it. I don’t see it coming. I could watch the weather. I know the date and everything, but until I feel it inside me, it hurts because it reminds me of that time in my life. More so in past years, I would go through the events. I don’t know if you do this. “This is when they told me this is what happened.” I go through it, torturing myself. It’s putting myself through it again. Sometimes, it’s inevitable.
Navigating Career And Parenthood With Grief
I feel like it’s a Netflix movie that I didn’t order that comes up like, “I didn’t ask to watch that.” It’s in this invisible screen, on the teleprompter, right there. I canceled that subscription. I did not want that to play anymore. I want to say the first couple of years, it played in Technicolor. I felt like I was there in that scenario. Another widow whose husband was actually a police officer. She talked about EMDR. A service that she’s used has helped her to try to bring you out of that, because it is so debilitating when that happens. You talked about the idea of it being hard. Your situation, everybody’s is different, but how are you navigating the children, your grief, and life today, or in this process?
I don’t know if it’s easier for me having the kids, but it definitely is a distraction. I know I have to be okay as much as we can for them, especially early on. That was a lot of burying the feelings and focusing on them. Eventually, I got into therapy. I still go off and on, but I’ve been in now. It provided a distraction. I could focus on them if they’re okay. I don’t have to worry about myself because I love saying, “Yes, I’m okay. I’m fine,” until someone calls me on and says, “Are you really? What’s going on?”
Children are a good distraction from grief. Share on XThat’s a good tip for someone whose friend has lost a loved one and they say they’re okay. Simply someone asking you, “Are you really?” lets them know it’s not a check-in-the-box thing.
I know someone who says, “Is there anything you don’t want to talk about?” That gets the wheels spinning.
I’m going to use that. Is there anything you don’t want to talk about? That’s good. That’s gold right there. That’s a tip for anybody who’s looking to support somebody who’s grieving to know that question. You talked about stuffing it down for the children. When did you get to cry? When did you get to be sad? When did you get to be devastated that this is your life now, if it was always about the children?
It was definitely not the first week after his death. I know I was running on anger and adrenaline. I don’t remember eating. I barely slept. It’s like an engine inside me, constantly going. After the funeral, I went upstairs to my mom’s room. I lay down and was like, “It’s over. I can rest.” I finally rested. I would bury it down. All of a sudden, it was like a spring popping up all of the emotions, the tears, and the grief. It happened that way, probably.
Reflecting On Her Husband’s Mental Struggles And Passing
You talked about the anger. You talked about Drew’s life ending by suicide. I don’t want to bog you down with questions on that, but I want you to have space to share as much as that process. Maybe when you noticed something about him or didn’t notice, if that’s something you want to share at your own pace without me bombarding. I don’t want to do that.
I believe that suicide is still the leading cause of death amongst law enforcement officers. It’s a huge problem, an epidemic of sorts. He struggled with mental health for many years. I would notice it in not getting out of bed. He was going to work, coming home, and that’s it. He was spending hours upon hours on the treadmill in our basement, avoiding anything. He would go to therapy, and then he wouldn’t. He’d be on meds. He’d say, “I don’t want to be on meds the rest of my life.” I believe that he should have been. There are a lot of mental health issues in his family as well. It got to a point where he would take out his feelings on me and the kids verbally and emotionally, and I had had it.
Suicide remains the leading cause of death among law enforcement officers. It can be considered an epidemic on its own. Share on XHe left one day. I won’t say exactly what he said for his privacy. It was very emotionally and verbally abusive, the things he said before he left, blaming me. He was gone a few days later. That guilt and that blame, I took his words and I held onto them. It was easier to blame myself than to blame him because he was a good guy, and I wanted him to be seen as that way. I don’t share this in every circle. I only share his actual words with very few people. It’s both for him. Also, I don’t want anyone’s opinion of him to be swayed. This is what’s hard with suicide because it’s not like other deaths at all.
How so?
Let’s say it was cancer. There are many different reasons, but you’d see the decline. You’d be expecting it in a way. People would say, “That’s so sad.” They would blame the cancer. With suicide, who do you blame? Do you blame him? That feels horrible. Do you blame his brain? I like to blame myself because then I didn’t have to worry about blaming him. I didn’t want to do that.
Is that fair to you, though?
No, I was going to say that. I realized that, but it took a while. I can still go there very easily. Thanks to a lot of therapy, I realized that it’s not anyone’s fault. If it wasn’t that moment between him and me, it might’ve been another moment that had nothing to do with anything. That thought was planted in his brain. It was going to be there forever.
It was something he had been fighting for a long time. You mentioned mental illness running in his family. Has that been something you’ve tried to navigate differently with your children to be aware of?
Yes. I am on them. I’m constantly checking in. I’m aware of the little things that they’ll say. Two of them have experienced intensive therapy. One of them said to me one time, “I don’t want to get out of bed. I’m too sad to get out of bed.” Call the therapist right away. I am very careful watching them.
Thank you. Going back to the idea that people are not sympathetic about the way you became a widow, does it make you want to give them a different version so they would be, for people who don’t know?
Yes. I’ve tried. There was a family member on his side who came at me afterwards. There are a lot of ugly things that happen regarding loss and grief. People will say things and act that they wouldn’t normally. This person wanted someone to blame. They wanted to blame me. I tried to tell them what happened and my side of the story. They didn’t want to hear it. It was soon after his death. I should have given this person that grace and not worried, but I wanted them to know my side. That was important to me. Since then, I’m more careful, but I definitely will if I need to.
People will try to weaponize another person’s actions as if you did the act yourself. I’m going to go out on a limb to say you would wish that Drew were here right now. You wish that he had been able to be okay with being on medication for the rest of your life if that’s what it takes to keep the things that are troubling you away.
Absolutely. Another thing with him in the last few days of his life, we talked about him getting more significant help than he was getting. His therapist gave him a week off. It was the perfect storm. Everything bad was happening. If he had gotten more help, if he had gone inpatient or something substantial like that, he was so afraid he would lose his job. He was so afraid they were going to take his gun away, and he was going to lose his job. I’ve since learned that that’s not the case. He was dead set on that. That’s what was going to happen. That was the last thing he wanted. I don’t think he wanted to die, but he was very sick at the moment. He was one-track-minded, “I can’t lose my job,” because he had tried so hard.
Offering Mental Health Support To Law Enforcement
That part right there. Let’s talk about that part. It could be somebody reading this right now who’s on the edge. You mentioned earlier in the conversation the percentage of people. I’m going to say law enforcement, first responders, and the military. There’s a lot of stress in those jobs. They are not out helping somebody get a cat out of the tree or helping an old lady cross the road. They are showing up when crime is happening. They are seeing the worst version of people eight hours a day, five or six days a week, and constantly building on top of each other what they saw and what they did. It could have gone from two neighbors arguing to child molestation to someone else in a car accident, and someone lost their life there, all in eight hours.
They get up and repeat that. It’s not the highest-paying job. Do you think people understand what law enforcement goes through, those who are genuinely there for the job, to love people? There’s always going to be a bad apple, but I would like to think that there are more good than there are those not doing right. What did it look like for him to come home? Did he talk about it? Did he try to leave it at the door? How did he manage his after-work self with the life that he was living at work?
It’s probably why the treadmill, that escape, or watching TV in our room, to decompress and also have that space to relax a little bit. I don’t think they have enough of that. I remember one call he was on. Afterwards, it was mandatory. They all had to have a session where they talked about it, but I can only think of one time in fourteen years or so that he was an officer. He did two years in New Fairfield, and then he transferred to Danbury when our oldest was a newborn. He worked there. That was where he always wanted to be.
He took the sergeant test. He took the detective test. He wanted to move up so badly. He failed it, or they didn’t choose him. Finally, he got to be a sergeant. He was a sergeant for one or two years, maybe. He did a lot of other things. He did FTO, Field Training Officer, so he was training the new guys. He was training them during Hurricane Sandy. I was home with the kids. I could hear the trees. I’m on the phone with my father-in-law, saying, “I hope my house doesn’t blow away.”
He was FTO with a new guy. He got horrible motion sickness, but he did it because he loved it. He always did things like that. I remember so many instances of him being such a good guy. There was a lower-income community next to the department, next to the police station. Someone called. There was a loud noise or something. He went over to check it out. He ended up playing basketball with these kids. That was the guy he was. He was definitely a good guy.
For the police officers who are afraid of losing their guns, what are some things that you’ve learned that they need to be aware of, instead of being one-track mind thinking they don’t have options?
There’s definitely help out there. It doesn’t make you less of a person or less of a man or woman when you ask for help. It doesn’t take away from your being good at your job, masculinity, or something. Whatever it is, it doesn’t take away. It probably actually adds to how you are as a person because it means that you’re prioritizing your mental health. You’re thinking of others as well. You’re thinking of your family and how you can keep your job and be able to support them as well.
How To Support Spouses Of Police Officers
Thank you. What about the spouses of police officers? It could be male or female.
Be there to listen, give suggestions, and know that you’re not alone as well. It was something that I talked about starting at his police department. I wanted to start a group for the spouses. I never got it off the ground. There is a lot of support out there for law enforcement officers and their families, so you don’t have to do it alone.
Thank you for sharing that. Having support, do you find a conversation different when talking to other widows who are widowed by suicide versus those who are not?
I pretty much only talked to those widowed by suicide. Early on, I talked to a few widows from Danbury. I became a part of the Blue H.E.L.P. community. I believe it’s called First H.E.L.P. now. I went to a memorial dinner in Washington, DC, in 2019, only for spouses of widows from law enforcement. All of us, so many people in a room, had dinner together. We had a memorial service that we put together with our spouses’ pictures. That was at the law enforcement memorial in Washington, DC. Our officers’ names are not allowed to be displayed there because of their manner of death, which is very unfortunate. We were able to do our own thing there.
How does that make you feel, that reality?
It’s heartbreaking because maybe he wasn’t killed in the line of duty. No disrespect to those and their families who were, but would he have done that if he weren’t an officer? It definitely led to significant trauma and mental health issues. It’s disappointing.
I can see that. Have you stayed in contact with some of those ladies? How has that relationship been on your grief chart?
It’s wonderful because sometimes, I have a light sense of humor. Sometimes I’ll have a dark sense of humor. Thank you, my people. Something will come up. I signed my kids up for swim camp or swim lessons. It wouldn’t let me skip the second parent. I had to go in and type NA, not applicable, for everything. I messaged them. I said, “Are you kidding me?” It’s probably in 2018 or 2019. I have to put in a second parent when that second parent is not there. I was angry, but I was laughing. It allows us to have that dark sense of humor that gets us through it because we get each other.
Saying Your Loved One’s Name And Hearing Their Stories
For the people who don’t get you, what are some things that they could do to maybe get into the inside? They’re like, “I love Erin. I’m tuning in to this show. I thought she had moved on, and she was okay. I’ve seen Erin laugh out with the kids. I thought that this was fine. I’m tuning in to this show. This still hurts.” What are some ways that they could invest or lean in, maybe for you or someone else they’re supporting, someone that’s grieving?
Just know that we are very good at putting on a brave face and posting stuff on Facebook that’s positive, but there’s always more truth behind what’s going on. Don’t believe everything you see. Don’t judge a book by its cover. Ask those questions like we talked about. “Is there anything you don’t want to talk about?” I know it’s been eight years, but I remember his name. I say his name. That’s important.
Grieving people know how to put on a brave face. But they always have things they do not want to talk about. Share on XThat part right there. We have an annual event called Walk for Love. It is the first full week of August. We ask people to walk 1 mile a day. At the end of that post, #WFL and hashtag your loved one’s name. I’ve learned that sometimes, seeing their name, people make it weird. It’s like, “I don’t want to say something to get you upset.” They’re always there. I’m always thinking about it. I don’t know how you think this is. For you, do you like hearing people say Drew’s name? What does that do for you? People telling stories about Drew or the opera silence, which would you prefer?
I totally get that. I want to hear his name. I want to hear the stories. I want to be able to share those stories with my kids. I posted something on Facebook or Instagram. Someone messaged me and said, “I remember him.” They told me a story. I was able to tell the kids, “Did you know this about daddy?” It was wonderful because you’re right. We know that they’re gone and they’re not coming back. It doesn’t make us think, “No.” It doesn’t make us sad, necessarily. It’s important to keep that alive.
Thank you for sharing that. I’ll say this as a caveat. Ask your person, “Would you prefer me to say their name?” Ask your person, “When I think of a story about them, can I text you or share with you? Would that be okay?” Take their lead. We may say yes, but you may have a person, and that may be devastating for them. I have learned that the majority of the people I talk to, it lets them know other people for real care, that this is genuinely still on your mind. When Mark passed, I was living in Pennsylvania. We were both trying to get a job in Virginia.
He had an apartment here, and I live in this area. I was going to drive from Pennsylvania. I was like, “I don’t know how I’m going to pull that off.” Some of my girlfriends said, “We’re going to clean up the apartment. Tell us what to do, and we’ll do everything.” I want to say it was maybe six months later, one of the ladies who did the cleaning up said, “I’ve got to tell you something. I was having a bad moment about Mark. I kept a couple of his shirts. I smell them, think about him, and cry. I think about how much love you guys had.”
Not that this was trauma-bonded, but I was like, “It is this bad. It is this hard.” When people share, we are our community. The people who knew us and the friends we spent time with are in pain with us. They may need permission to share. I think it was about the one-year anniversary because I started telling everybody, “I want to hear every Mark story you have.” I went to them. I need to hear because in my mind, it’s like, “This happened, right? I loved him.” Have you ever had that? “I need reinforcement that this was a real thing.”
Yes, definitely. Time changes things, our perception, my perception of him, trying to remember things about him, and even the sound of his voice. It is very important. I did have someone reach out to me. There is a 5K race that we go to almost every September that was started by a widow in Connecticut whose husband died by suicide from East Hartford. His name is Paul. They have a race every September, and we go.
Someone messaged me, “Is it okay if I put Drew’s name on the shirts that we’re making to run, to do the race, to walk the race?” I said, “Yes. Can we do the shirts as well? I think we’re all going to participate in that.” That was nice. I’ve never met this person before. Someone that she knows also died by suicide in Danbury a couple of years ago. I’ve connected with them. It was a wonderful reminder that people are still thinking about him.
Does it matter to you if people are thinking about Drew or not, and why?
I feel like we’ve been forgotten by a lot of people. I know that is a very common experience, especially in law enforcement. I don’t hear from anyone at the department. That started way sooner after his death than I had hoped for.
How soon?
The first year is very full of amazing things. This is something I wanted to talk about, too. People were so kind after he passed. My neighbor, Mary, started a GoFundMe. She started a meal train. People delivered meals through November or early December every night. People came, and they helped clean the house when I wasn’t here. People did things for the kids. There’s one of the elementary schools in town. I’m good friends with someone on the PTO board.
She made it so that Tyler can attend any after-school activity for free for a year. The things people gave us, movie tickets, they took the kids out, so many kind things. They did invite us to the annual Danbury Police Christmas party in December, but we were going to visit my brother in Nebraska. We ended up not going. Pretty soon after that first year, maybe a year and a half, I don’t hear from anyone.
What do people need to know? This happened a year and a half later.
It’s still all of those.
Comparing Year One And Year Two Of Grief
Do you think year two sucks more than year one?
It all sucks.
That’s fair. Let me say this. I experienced an immense amount of grief fog in year one. When I try to go back and recall, if I’m not looking at my journal, I read that, and I go, “We did that?” Year two, I was like, “That’s all of it. There’s no buffer.” That’s what I meant. What does a year one versus year two look like for you?
I definitely understand that. The protection that our brain is trying to give us is like a buffer, as you said. I see that. I see how you lose that. You don’t have a little brain as much, although I think we’re always stuck with it.
You said you wanted to talk about the way support changed a year and a half later. Were there some other things you wanted to make sure that we spoke about?
No, just the kindness of people that came out of nowhere. It also helped me be able to support people that I’ve seen go through it, like with groceries. Someone, an officer from Drew’s department, passed a couple of years ago. I wasn’t close to him or his wife or anything. I did not want to go to the funeral. I said it’s going to be too hard. It’s going to be too emotional.
I ended up going, and I reached out to his widow. We’ve built a friendship because I know what to do now. I will probably reach out to her tonight and be like, “I’m thinking of you,” because I don’t ever want to be one of those people that I see now and think, “I wish that they had reached out. I wish that we weren’t forgotten about.” It gives me that perspective of what it feels like, and I’m able to use that to help others.
It does because your person’s dead and you’re forgotten about. It’s like a double whammy. Do you think people feel awkward or weird, or don’t know what to say to someone who has lost their spouse to suicide?
Yes, I do. When I went to that officer’s funeral, I saw the other officers there. They were grieving. It definitely helped me to remember they’re humans and they’re grieving as well. It’s not just about me. It’s not always about us. It’s about them as well. What are they feeling? It’s got to be hard for them, too. They lost Drew, and they loved him. He was such a good guy. My family called him Jimmy Stewart because he was so kind and everything. I know it’s hard for them, too. It’s hard to put myself in those shoes sometimes because I want to be mad and I want to be resentful.
If you were mad and resentful, what would that look like for you?
I definitely went through periods of that in the beginning, unfriending them on Facebook.
Massive de-friending.
I’m like, “Who are you to treat me like that? You don’t even know me.” I am subtle.
How To Help Children Going Through Grief
It’s ghosting some people. If someone said, “What is one thing I could do to help a child who is grieving?” Any recommendations?
A child that they’re related to?
A child you know that’s grieving.
The first thing that came up was making a book for them with pictures or stories that they have about the person that they lost, and giving it not to the child, but to whoever takes care of the child when they think it’s appropriate to give it to them. Those are things that are easily forgotten. My son was six when Drew died. I know that there’s so much he doesn’t remember. He wants to be a police officer. He watches The Rookie. He loves to talk about Drew, but he doesn’t remember those stories. Having that would be lovely.
Never Compare Your Grief Journey With Others
If you were in a room on a stage talking to people who are grieving, what are 1 to 3 things you would recommend for them in their grieving process from your experience?
I would try to tell them not to compare themselves to other people, that the grief, the journey, is not linear. I don’t know if this is your experience, Tina, but we don’t go through this and this. I remember learning. I have a degree in psychology. I wrote them down on my exam. That’s not true. We go through them, but it’s not linear. Everyone’s journey is different. The things that they do to cope are different. It doesn’t make you less or worse of a person or better of a person. Everything is very individualized. Don’t beat yourself up.
Do you think some things are common, though also? What would those commonalities look like?
It’s common to have hard days, even if you have a streak of good days. I’ll do that a lot. I’ll say, “I’m feeling great,” and then something will hit me like a memory or the day I talked about where it goes from a hot day to a cool day. It comes out of nowhere. That’s okay. It’s frustrating, but it’s not going to be like that forever.
Grief hits you in the most unexpected moments. It is certainly frustrating, but it does not have to be like that forever. Share on XIt’s not going to be like that. Has your grief changed over the eight years?
Yes.
How so?
I don’t go through the Netflix movie, like we talked about. I don’t put myself through that anymore because it doesn’t do any good at all. This is the last thing. I try not to think about it. On those days, especially September 3rd and the days before and after it, I try to be kind to myself, comfort food or whatever, a good night’s sleep, and doing something with the kids. On the anniversary of his death, we always do something together. My daughter has always started a new job on that day. I don’t know why it’s worked out that way historically, but we try to see a movie or get ice cream.
You do something like that.
Yes.
How has this conversation been for you?
It’s been good. Like you said, I’m comfortable.
Honoring A Loved One’s Memory Through Tattoos
I noticed the tattoos. Are any of these tattoos honoring Drew or a representation of him? Can you share those with us?
This is the first one that I got. It’s the semicolon for mental health, the kids, and on the other side of the heart. I got his badge on my arm. That was a little over a year after his death. It was my way of honoring him.
That was my first ink that I got. It’s the only tattoo I have since Mark passed. I can relate to that.
What did you get?
Don’t judge me because I’m not dressed top to bottom. I actually have on shorts.
No judgment.
Mark loved to hunt. He was a deer hunter. This is the face of a deer, but I have roses to forever love. These are the horns of the deer right there. I didn’t want to put his name on me, but I felt like this was a good representation of love and something very symbolic of who he was and what he loved to do.
That’s beautiful. Did it hurt?
When I went to the artists, they were like, “You have to schedule with the artists.” I was like, “This is not what I remember tattoo parlors being like. This is boujee.” I brought in the artwork of what I found. They were like, “This is going to be good.” It was supposed to be set up for three-hour sessions. I was like, “Can I take three hours?” I was in better shape then. I’ve had acupuncture. I’m a breast cancer survivor. It felt like a lot of that.
It wasn’t painful. It felt like a lot of little bee stings or something. My daughter was there. The guy had a movie we could watch. He entertained. He said, “How old are you?” I was like, “50 plus.” He said, “You got good skin.” It took half the time that he had planned. It came out nicely, so I was satisfied. I’d always wanted a tattoo when I was in the army. I never did. I got this tattoo on the day that was our wedding anniversary. That happened to be the only day that they had a schedule. I was like, “Are you kidding me?”
No coincidences.
Turning Grief Into A Purpose And Mission
Erin, I have asked you a lot of questions. You’ve been good at that in answering. Any questions you have for me?
It’s not a question, but it’s something that you made me think of a second ago when you said it was your wedding anniversary. I see the number 576 everywhere. That was his number. I saw two cars with 576, or Dunkin’ Donuts will be the number on the cup. I’m always taking pictures and sending them to the kids. I feel like he’s everywhere.
That’s nice.
How are you doing? How is year eight for you?
Sometimes, I’m like, “He left this world eight years ago? This really happened.” It is mind-boggling to me. In the first part of the year, up until March 11, when Mark passed, I was reading from my journal one journal entry a week. My triggering season is March, when Mark passed, and then going into May, which is my birthday. We got married after my birthday. I don’t recommend that to anybody. Think of the long game. Mother’s Day, then it’s his birthday, and then Father’s Day.
From the end of April-ish until the end of June, I clear my schedule. I’ve learned how to say no. If it’s not something I have to do, I try to get as much off my plate because his birthday and his death anniversary, those two are super hard for me. I’ve learned to tap out. I’m not going to be at work and be anybody’s supervisor. I’m not doing this. I’m not doing that. I need to focus on myself. It is because it still hurts.
Interestingly enough, in my spare bedroom, there are still some things that were Mark-centric that I’m keeping for the kids. I was trying to do some things in the guest room and make it a little bit more friendly. I had to pull all those things out. I was pulling stuff and changing out beddings. I came across this program from his service. I stopped everything. I crawled up on the blankets on the floor. It’s been a long time since I read that. I laughed. The tears didn’t come flushing out, but they were hovering right there. I was like, “I remember that day. I remember that service. I remember the honor guard and the folding of his flag. A lot has happened.”
Even though this has been hard, I would have chosen him all over again. If I knew that I still had to go that way, I would have never imagined that day on vacation, him passing. It would lead to me having conversations with people, giving them a safe space to talk about their loved one, to have an entire nonprofit supporting people who are grieving, having a retreat in December in Atlanta for widows, having a big fundraiser here in 2026, or being able to have tools or assets. I’m having a grief support meeting at 7:00 and doing things for people.
I didn’t start off like, “My husband died, and I’m going to make purpose out of my pain.” No, this found me in the process of this. It’s okay that it’s not okay sometimes. Your whole person left this world, and this is devastating. I’ve learned to be okay with saying his name. People ask me, so I was like, “My late husband X.” No X. He died. Do not disrespect me with that. I’m still not a fan of it. I’ve learned to be at peace with it. It’s the things, as my children’s lives are changing, and how to manage the absence of their dad. My siblings joined in, my children’s godparents being part of that, because I can’t be Mark. I can only be me.
You could only be you. I love that. I love what you’ve done and the good things you’ve channeled your grief or your power, your energy, into that.
It is a calling from God. Widowhood Real Talk with Tina is a non-profit, non-religious-based organization. Anybody, any faith, any belief that this is about your pain and us showing up and supporting you. I feel as if it is God calling me to be in this space to support, love, and help people, and do that. Let love show up. Let support show up because it is hard. It is already the hardest experience I’ve had in my life, let alone to feel like you’re alone and nobody cares. If someone can listen to a podcast, watch a video, or do something, and know there are other people who feel this way, I’m not alone. If that person made it, maybe I can, too, find something that I can keep on living for. Life can change.
Erin shared about going to therapy after. It was hard. Maybe therapy is okay. That’s something I can do. This can help me because we learn from our stories. I’ve written an entire book. I am doing the final edits on that and getting ready to have that available to tell the story of grief in these five widows, not my memoirs, but a real, raw story of five women. There’ll be a book about five men, and then their children. We don’t want to read a grief guide, but we can read a juicy novel. Hopefully, this will do that.
I like what you said about doing things on your own a second ago. It reminded me of when I took my daughter to get the last set of her tubes in her ears. It was just her and me. It was September 2018. It was a year after he passed. That was one of the hardest things I’ve ever had to do. It was her fourth set of tubes. He was always there with me. He was the one who would bring her back and calm her down because she would be fighting like crazy. To do that on my own, it was one of the hardest things.
Also, like you said a second ago, it was empowering that I got to do that. I could do that on my own. My nephew had surgery, and I went. I sat with my sister-in-law. My brother had to work. He’s alive, but I remember that was like. It was May 2018. We all went to Ireland, my dad’s side of the family. My daughter Kayla was fourteen at the time. I took her. She and I went to London and Paris after that on our own. I was able to do that. That was terrifying, but it was also empowering. I want to say, not to be Pollyanna, but there are things that we learn as widows that we can do on our own that are very empowering, especially as someone who has gone through so much trauma.
I would agree with that. We find an inner strength in ourselves that we did not have to tap into because our husbands held that space. There were weeks I did not take a shower or a bath right after Mark passed, but there can come a point where you can go, “You did that. I’m proud of you.” That’s okay. It can be okay because the reality is our story is still continuing, our purpose, our reason, our life. Even though we wish they were here, it doesn’t take away that our lives are not important. We deserve to live.
I personally feel like widows should be celebrated. We did a whole thing. We stayed committed. We were in this marriage. We said, “Till death do us part,” and we did that. Some younger women would do well for me to connect with widows, even if it was a widow who endured a horrible marriage, and what she learned from that. Maybe that would make you walk away sooner. Someone has done something this phenomenal that you look at marital statistics and what that looks like, especially for younger widows. There’s something different to navigate when you don’t look like what the world thinks a widow should look like in trying to navigate that.
I do get questions sometimes. I’ll be in the store, or when I used to work at a treatment facility, I’d have a dress on or a shirt on like this. People would say, “Is that your dad?” I’ll be like, “No, that was my husband.” They’ll be like, “Were you a police officer?” I said, “No, it was my husband.” That’s like what we said about choosing what we share with different people. Sometimes, I like to cover it up. No one will see it, but it does bring awareness that I was 36 and that’s not normal, but neither is dying in the way you did. It goes against everything that our bodies and our brains tell us. They deserve to be supported just as much.
I’m so glad I asked about the tattoo and allowed you to share that.
Me, too.
Get In Touch With Erin
Thank you for being willing to have this conversation. I’m going to say something to the audience, and then I would like for you to close out this conversation, whatever you want to share, something we didn’t talk about, or information, and where people can find you on social media, and where you’re located. I want to say thank you for being part of this conversation. I am sorry for the person who is no longer here that drove you here, but I’m glad you’re here. If you’re interested in connecting, please email me at WidowhoodRealTalk@gmail.com.
Thank you, Tina. I was super nervous, but I’m so glad to have had this opportunity and for someone to hopefully get something out of it. If not now, maybe someday down the road. It’s a group or club that you never want to be a part of, but it’s so good to know you’re not alone. Thank you so much. A lot of beautiful things have happened to me since this experience. I have two degrees since then. I graduated from nursing school. I got my first job as a nurse. I start in two more weeks. It’s the biggest blessing. I’m so grateful. I’m on TikTok and on Instagram.
We’ll see you guys in the next episode.
